Summary + Transcript

Chat

00:02:19 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: That’s great! I’ve just started Module 3.
00:02:32 Pauline Wiles: Reacted to “That’s great! I’ve j…” with
00:04:22 Pauline Wiles: Win – got a “yes” from 2 co-authors who did paid discovery. (For context, also got a “no thanks” from a conversation where I sent a proposal only.) With a small sample size, paid discovery is really helpful for me.
00:04:36 Meg McConnell: Reacted to “Win – got a “yes” fr…” with
00:04:39 Ruby Javaid: Reacted to “Win – got a “yes” fr…” with
00:05:07 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Replying to “Win – got a “yes” fr…”

And how did you handle the “no thanks” emotionally/ mindset wise?
00:05:18 Michelle: Reacted to “Win – got a “yes” fr…” with
00:06:59 Pauline Wiles: Replying to “Win – got a “yes” fr…”

I'm in a busy-enough phase at the moment, so it's fine. I'm working on trusting that the right clients will come along … and when it's a fit, it's amazing. I'm moving past the point where I want anyone hiring me who isn't super excited to make the investment.
00:07:09 Danielle Cooke: Hi Erica. Will the open house be different to the webinar that Shannon ran a couple of weeks ago?
00:07:09 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Reacted to “I'm in a busy-enough…” with
00:07:58 Tracy Trathen • e design studio, LLC: Win 1 – person who said “no” last year, but I reached out (via this call’s outreach) a few weeks ago, they are having me rebuild their website.

Win 2 – Also received an email this morning from a client (I built her site and she’s a WebCare client). She is changing their business and wants me to redo their SEO.
00:08:12 Ruby Javaid: Reacted to “Win 1 – person who s…” with
00:08:17 Danielle Cooke: Reacted to “Win 1 – person who s…” with
00:08:25 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Going through mindset transformations because of Module 3, and shared with my sister and mom, who I work with, and now they’re ALSO realizing their value, and now we’re going to redo our Patricks together as a family biz/agency.
00:08:36 Tracy Trathen • e design studio, LLC: Reacted to “Going through mindse…” with
00:08:38 Pauline Wiles: Reacted to “Win 1 – person who s…” with
00:08:38 Jenelle: Win – with more iterations of my process, I’m starting to get faster at things!
00:08:44 Michelle: Reacted to “Win – with more iter…” with
00:08:48 Pauline Wiles: Reacted to “Going through mindse…” with
00:08:56 Kim Blake: WIN: I kept following up with a client for a year who was interested in a revamp, and I am now preparing a proposal for them.
00:09:01 Pauline Wiles: Reacted to “Win – with more iter…” with
00:09:05 Ruby Javaid: Reacted to “WIN: I kept followin…” with
00:09:11 Ruby Javaid: Reacted to “Win – with more iter…” with
00:09:16 Liz Lee: Reacted to “Win 1 – person who s…” with
00:09:20 Ruby Javaid: Reacted to “Going through mindse…” with
00:09:31 Pauline Wiles: Replying to “WIN: I kept followin…”

Amazing tenacity! Great job!
00:09:36 Danielle Cooke: Reacted to “Going through mindse…” with
00:09:39 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Replying to “WIN: I kept followin…”

Timing is so important. Sometimes they’re only Potential Clients when we plant seeds
00:09:41 Tracy Trathen • e design studio, LLC: Reacted to “WIN: I kept followin…” with
00:09:48 Danielle Cooke: Reacted to “Win – with more iter…” with
00:09:53 Jenelle: Reacted to “I'm in a busy-enough…” with
00:10:07 Jenelle: Reacted to “Win 1 – person who s…” with
00:10:18 Jenelle: Reacted to “Going through mindse…” with
00:10:30 Tracy Trathen • e design studio, LLC: Reacted to “Win – with more iter…” with
00:10:51 Jenelle: Reacted to “WIN: I kept followin…” with
00:10:57 Stephani – The Simple Growth Co: Reacted to “WIN: I kept followin…” with
00:10:59 Stephani – The Simple Growth Co: Reacted to “Win – with more iter…” with
00:11:01 Stephani – The Simple Growth Co: Reacted to “Going through mindse…” with
00:11:02 Jenelle: Reacted to “Timing is so importa…” with
00:11:04 Stephani – The Simple Growth Co: Reacted to “Win 1 – person who s…” with
00:11:06 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: We’re ALSO simultaneously trying to help boost businesses in the disaster space, so we’re excited to help TRANSFORM their own mindsets around realizing each of their own specific intrinsic value in their businesses.

We can’t wait to take all we learn from WDA and share with every client and business we can reach.
00:11:07 Stephani – The Simple Growth Co: Reacted to “I'm in a busy-enough…” with
00:11:10 Pauline Wiles: Reacted to “Timing is so importa…” with
00:11:18 Tracy Trathen • e design studio, LLC: Reacted to “We’re ALSO simultane…” with
00:11:21 Pauline Wiles: Reacted to “We’re ALSO simultane…” with
00:11:35 Shannon Mattern: Hey Name!

I was thinking about you the other day and wanted to reach out and see if you still needed help with X?

I know it wasn’t the right time back in Y when we talked, but just wanted to touch base and let you know that I’ve got some new options for working together and there’s one that might be a great fit for you!

Would you like me to send you more info?
00:11:39 Ruby Javaid: Reacted to “We’re ALSO simultane…” with
00:13:08 Shannon Mattern: Reacted to “We’re ALSO simultane…” with
00:13:15 Shannon Mattern: Replying to “We’re ALSO simultane…”

Such important work!!
00:13:44 Michelle: (I'm early because I actually did this exact one yesterday!)
00:14:00 Shannon Mattern: Reacted to “ (I'm early bec…” with
00:16:45 Kim Blake:
00:16:52 Shannon Mattern: Reacted to “” with
00:17:14 Sarah Guilliot (SarahDesign.com):
00:17:25 Shannon Mattern: Reacted to “” with
00:17:33 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Reacted to “Win – with more iter…” with
00:17:37 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Reacted to “WIN: I kept followin…” with
00:17:48 Ruby Javaid:
00:18:13 Maggie Luk:
00:18:30 Michelle: Welcome!!
00:18:41 Pauline Wiles: Reacted to “Welcome!!” with
00:18:53 Maggie Luk: I have my 1 year old in the room fyi
00:25:54 Pauline Wiles: Yes, I've struggled with that line between being helpful and working for free, especially in a “networking” situation.
00:30:45 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Replying to “Yes, I've struggled …”

Who’s working for FREE?!
00:31:03 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Reacted to “Who’s working for FR…” with
00:31:06 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Reacted to “Who’s working for FR…” with
00:31:13 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Reacted to “Who’s working for FR…” with
00:31:24 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Reacted to “I have my 1 year old…” with
00:31:27 Pauline Wiles: Reacted to “Who’s working for FR…” with
00:31:37 Tracy Trathen • e design studio, LLC: Replying to “Yes, I've struggled …”

I hear you. It’s hard to say “no” when you’ve got a servants heart (I struggle with the same)
00:32:16 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: I think I come from generations of NURTURERS, but have seen them taken for granted, abused, or under appreciated and not valuing themselves, so now I’m a RULER
00:32:35 Tracy Trathen • e design studio, LLC: Reacted to “I think I come from …” with
00:32:59 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Replying to “I think I come from …”

I want NURTURERS and CAREGIVERS to know that there is POWER in caring, because people need us. We have power in helping
00:33:59 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: I’ve just designed some shirts for disaster volunteers and gave them WINGS on their sleeves because I want them to know they’re being literal angels. Hope all of you Nurturers out there value yourselves in how you are helping others who need you! <3 <3 <3
00:34:42 Maggie Luk: Got to head out to my other job – full time mom thanks everyone!
00:35:18 Michelle: Reacted to “Got to head out to m…” with
00:35:22 Tracy Trathen • e design studio, LLC: I was raised the same way. However, when I changed how I think about it – when I ask about their revenue, it’s truly to help THEM – to make sure I can help them grow that. Their business revenue isn’t the same as their income (what they pay themselves). Once I separated those two things, it was easier to ask them the questions.
00:35:33 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Reacted to “Got to head out to m…” with
00:36:13 Tracy Trathen • e design studio, LLC: Reacted to “I’ve just designed s…” with
00:36:33 Michelle: Reacted to “I was raised the sam…” with
00:40:23 Kim Blake: I find that asking what your average sales or customer value is isn’t so personal and an easier ask.
00:40:52 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Reacted to “I was raised the sam…” with
00:40:58 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Reacted to “I was raised the sam…” with
00:40:59 Pauline Wiles: I admit, I had those 10 questions in my form for only a short time before I introduced paid discovery, and it feels much more natural to ask some of that stuff in the deep-dive phase. So my first form is much shorter now.
00:41:20 Pauline Wiles: Reacted to “I find that asking w…” with
00:41:36 Kim Blake: Reacted to “I admit, I had those…” with
00:42:36 Sarah Guilliot (SarahDesign.com): I can’t remember the ten questions recommended in WDA but can share my experience!

I’ve noticed that when someone doesn’t answer my optional revenue question (I ask about revenue streams and pricing) I feel a little awkward and worried they think I’m being intrusive. But also it helps me know how to approach talking to them in our 1:1 call because I can see that they’re private about that and I can try to gather that info another way.

I also ask how many clients and sales they get now and how many they want to get in a year and that helps me understand money and value better too.
00:42:42 Michelle: Reacted to “I admit, I had those…” with
00:42:47 Sarah Guilliot (SarahDesign.com): Reacted to “I admit, I had those…” with
00:43:22 Pauline Wiles: Replying to “I find that asking w…”

Love this, not quite so direct, and then easier to have the conversation about ROI, based on added customers.
00:43:38 Michelle: Reacted to “I find that asking w…” with
00:44:19 Sarah Guilliot (SarahDesign.com): I’m a fan of intake forms! They tell us so much!
00:44:23 Sarah Guilliot (SarahDesign.com): Reacted to “I find that asking w…” with
00:44:32 Sarah Guilliot (SarahDesign.com): Replying to “I find that asking w…”
Ooh good one
00:45:33 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: I can’t wait to not be awkward talking about money. This WDA is totally a personality makeover for me over here
00:45:43 Sarah Guilliot (SarahDesign.com): Reacted to “I can’t wait to not …” with
00:45:55 Danielle Cooke: Reacted to “I can’t wait to not …” with
00:46:06 Ruby Javaid: Reacted to “I can’t wait to not …” with
00:47:07 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: I was supposed to be a Teacher! My grandmas and aunties are all teachers tooooo. It comes with a lot of Poor Trauma
00:47:11 Tracy Trathen • e design studio, LLC: I’m a child of teachers (and I have a LOT of family members who are also teachers) – so I get that totally!
00:47:20 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: What made you realize you weren’t a teacher anymore??
00:47:48 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Reacted to “I’m a child of teach…” with
00:48:02 Sarah Guilliot (SarahDesign.com): Another way to think about it is asking about their revenue as a service provider is different than asking at a dinner party it’s relevant to the service! Like with your accountant…they get to see the money details because it’s relevant to the service. Just like you.
00:48:22 Jenelle: Reacted to “Another way to think…” with
00:48:45 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Erica is an EDUCATIONAL business owner still teaching. <3
00:48:53 Jenelle: Thank you so much Erica! And so sorry, I have to run to pick up my son!
00:48:57 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Reacted to “Thank you so much Er…” with
00:49:27 Tracy Trathen • e design studio, LLC: Replying to “Erica is an EDUCATIO…”

Exactly. I am a teacher… just not in (and never have been) in a school (I am always teaching people stuff LOL)
00:50:07 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Did you yell at him
00:50:12 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: DID YOU YELL AT HIM
00:50:14 Michelle: That dude needs to kick rocks.
00:50:40 Tracy Trathen • e design studio, LLC: Reacted to “That dude needs to k…” with
00:50:55 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Reacted to “That dude needs to k…” with
00:51:01 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Reacted to “That dude needs to k…” with
00:51:02 Tracy Trathen • e design studio, LLC: Reacted to “That dude needs to k…” with
00:52:46 Michelle: This is ME!! I've personally started saying something along the lines of “this is a super exciting idea, and I would love to help you with it. Let's put it on a list for phase 2.”
00:52:56 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Are we feeling AWKARD about money because we haven’t internalized our VALUE still?
00:53:05 Michelle: Reacted to “Are we feeling AWKAR…” with
00:53:40 Tracy Trathen • e design studio, LLC: Reacted to “This is ME!! I've pe…” with
00:53:57 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: I would love to work with someone as enthusiastic as Ruby in my biz!
00:54:44 Kim Blake: I'd ask if these items need to be fulfilled before launch. If yes, say you’ll need to send over a proposal and revised timeline. If no and it can wait, then you can follow up with a proposal.
00:56:06 Kim Blake: 5 minute freebies add to an hour of unpaid time.
00:56:18 Michelle: Reacted to “I'd ask if these ite…” with
00:56:22 Michelle: Reacted to “5 minute freebies ad…” with
00:57:23 Michelle: I like this idea!
00:57:24 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Replying to “5 minute freebies ad…”

Task switching and lost opportunity cost of your time and attention!
00:57:30 Pauline Wiles: Replying to “5 minute freebies ad…”

Yep. “Creep” is the perfect term for these teeny sneaky bits.
00:57:35 Ruby Javaid: Reacted to “5 minute freebies ad…” with
00:57:39 Ruby Javaid: Reacted to “I would love to work…” with
01:00:14 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: “Additional work will be billed at $___/hr”
01:00:35 Pauline Wiles: Yes, for a $$$$ project, I don't want to “nickel and dime” them!
Shannon definitely flags this risk, for the high end package.
01:00:36 Michelle: There's a meme out there that says something along the lines of $500 client: make a million more changes and don't charge me $50,000: Great. Just bill me.
01:01:07 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Replying to “There's a meme out t…”

I need this as my wallpaper
01:01:14 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Reacted to “There's a meme out t…” with
01:01:15 Pauline Wiles: Reacted to “There's a meme out t…” with
01:01:21 Michelle: Meaning businesses who invest up front understand the value and don't mind continuing to invest.
01:02:09 Michelle: Replying to “There's a meme out t…”

https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/500-vs-50000-client-jenessa-tay/
01:02:35 Pauline Wiles: Replying to “There's a meme out t…”

Totally. A friend of mine just received a massive wishlist from a potential client, and the client had the nerve to say she thought it needed “about 2 hours”. I looked it over for her, and estimate it's 4 VIP days. And the client is looking to spend about $300.
01:02:51 Michelle: Reacted to “Totally. A friend of…” with
01:03:01 Ruby Javaid: Reacted to “There's a meme out t…” with
01:04:10 Michelle: Replying to “There's a meme out t…”

I have one like this who wants to do an entire rebrand in one week, has changed the name twice, and has changed the look/feel he wants twice. But still wants it done this week and doesn't understand why it will cost more.
01:06:26 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: I love Erica absolving all of us designers of our shame and blame! That feels so cathartic when we’re carry the weight of being responsible for so many parts of their website/identity/business.
01:06:35 Michelle: Reacted to “I love Erica absolvi…” with
01:06:36 Pauline Wiles: Reacted to “I love Erica absolvi…” with
01:07:34 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: But also its the plugins fault for upselling their tiers lol
01:08:01 Kim Blake: Thanks for the call, I have to go.
01:08:05 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Reacted to “Thanks for the call,…” with
01:08:12 Tracy Trathen • e design studio, LLC: I’ve done something similar this way (had something similar happen). You frame it as YOU offering the solution. Becaaue you are!!! And any time I’ve framed this way to a client (things change SO fast in our industry) — Clients have been SO appreciative of me being on top of it.
01:08:36 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Or you FIGURED OUT this solution to a problem that appeared on their end because of the plugin, and you had the SOLUTION to this new update
01:08:44 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Reacted to “I’ve done something …” with
01:09:07 Tracy Trathen • e design studio, LLC: Replying to “Or you FIGURED OUT t…”

EXACTLY this!
01:09:31 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Replying to “Or you FIGURED OUT t…”

I love that you had the backup license! You already saved yourself!
01:09:50 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Should we buy licenses for this plugin??
01:10:12 Jenelle: What’s the plugin? I came in late.
01:10:14 Michelle: Replying to “Should we buy licens…”

It depends on the feeling I'm getting from the client for me.
01:10:16 Ruby Javaid: Reacted to “I’ve done something …” with
01:10:22 Ruby Javaid: Reacted to “Or you FIGURED OUT t…” with
01:11:07 Ruby Javaid: Reacted to “Totally. A friend of…” with
01:11:12 Casey Nishikawa Morrin: Reacted to “What’s the plugin? I…” with
01:11:28 Ruby Javaid: Reacted to “I love Erica absolvi…” with
01:11:29 Sarah Guilliot (SarahDesign.com): Reacted to “I love Erica absolvi…” with
01:11:39 Sarah Guilliot (SarahDesign.com): Reacted to “Or you FIGURED OUT t…” with
01:12:16 Ruby Javaid: Replying to “What’s the plugin? I…”

Jenelle it's called wishlist member
01:12:35 Ruby Javaid: Replying to “Should we buy licens…”

@Casey if only they still sold the lifetime ones!
01:12:41 Jenelle: Replying to “What’s the plugin? I…”

Thanks!
01:13:10 Ruby Javaid: Reacted to “EXACTLY this!” with
01:13:14 Ruby Javaid: Reacted to “I love that you had …” with